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10:15 - 11:45 |
THE EMERGING MARKETS PLACE |
Serge Grimaux & Colleen Ironside |
(Room 2, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden]
Chairmen:
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Chairmen's Comments:
Serge: "I enjoyed this experience very much. I was very pleased by the fact that it did not turn into a complaining, match and that no one tried to hijack the panel to deal with their own personal issues. In any case, I had prepared myself in case this would have happened and I would have dealt with this quite quickly! That said, I would have wish for this panel to be even more business oriented. My goal was to provide the audience with the understanding of the huge potential the so-called Emerging Markets represent. I think we succeeded but unfortunately we had many more words than figures and, as you know, figures are kind of important when comes the time to talk business! In that regard, if I were to do it again, I would prepare myself differently and make sure that we really get deeper into the business matters. Thanks for inviting me." Colleen: "Serge and I spent a lot of time discussing how best to do this panel to try and cover as many emerging markets as possible and I would like to thank all our panelists who covered such a large area of the globe - not only Michael Hosking but Phil Rodriquez who is one of the pioneers from South America, Venkat from India and also Keith Bradley who gave the panel a different perspective - someone who has been a production manager for many tours who toured emerging markets before anyone else with artists such as the Police in India in the early 80's and who through his work as World Tour Director for Elton John has done many unusual shows in Greece, Turkey, Eastern Europe and of course Asia including India, China and the Middle East. As Serge says, what didn't really emerge were many figures which, when it comes down to it, is what it's all about for everyone. Perhaps there is an area for future discussion wherein these are now considered to be not so much emergingā markets, but less importantā and therefore acceptable for acts wanting to command the same fees as they do in major, markets, to tour with less production and a different show thus saving costs on what they present in major markets." Michael Hosking said, "I think the/our panel in general covered off on most issues regarding the 'emerging markets' -. I did like the 'emerging/submerging' line and think that applies to all of the markets in Asia at various times. Thank you for giving us the opportunity to get our views across to our colleagues. I don't think we were making any particularly ground-breaking statements but it is still useful to remind people of the challenges we face in these market places." Related Post-Conference News: CHINA: British artists, composers, songwriters, labels, publishers and management companies are set to benefit from this new UK Music Services office opened in China on Monday 16th May: The new facility, based in Beijing, will provide a single point of contact for independent UK music companies from all areas of the industry. It will co-ordinate introductions to potential licensees and licensors and help arrange meetings with local promoters, tour sponsors and merchandising companies, as well as local record companies, music publishers, and legal representatives. The initiative was put together in association with SWAT Enterprises; the leading music marketing consultancy in China by the Association of Independent Music (AIM) and UK Trade & Investment. IQ Magazine - 2005 Spring issue (Late May) carries a report on the live industry in the Middle East - and a report on India is scheduled for the 2005 Summer issue (August) |
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10:15 - 11:45 |
SAFETY IN NUMBERS |
Chrissy Uerlings |
[Room 3, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden] Chairmen:
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10:15 - 11:45
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THE MANAGER'S OFFICE |
Stuart Worthington
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[Room 4, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden]
Chairman:
This year the Managers discussed the varying income generating "business models" of the relationship between their clients - the artists - and the live industry at different stages in their careers, focusing on: |
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Developing artists who can't command substantial fees but need to play as often
as possible to develop a great show and sell tickets to establish their fan base;
'Heritage Artists' who can top up gig fees by using the live circuit as a retail
outlet to sell own label CDs at a significant profit margin, sometimes (as with
Marillion) getting fans to fund CDs / DVDs; For Pop acts it is usually pointless
to risk money on touring, better to chase the occasional lucrative corporate
gigs, and concentrate on media exposure and major label backing, chart positions
and retail racking to build fan base; Superstar 'heritage' artists - who, often
still signed and making records play fewer but bigger concerts to expanded
audiences consisting of fans and those attending for the event. They tend not to
sell albums at gigs in order to avoid conflicts with retailers; With Mainland
European artists Promoters & Managers often take the financial risk, as lack of
export sales preclude record company tour support..
We also considered alternative and additional funding sources which involve potential conflicts for Managers: Record company participation in live income sometimes via Venture Capitalist Trusts and Corporate Sponsors, and Agents financing new acts. And finally Promoters' promotional costs - and what they indicate about confidence in, and potential for, sales. Also discussed were The opportunities to "package" export (e.g. UK) acts with overseas artists, and the ticket sales potential that's often overlooked by management. The lack of significant (if any) income generated by mobile distribution of live music that finds its way back to the artist, and the fact that artists should maintain mobile rights unless the record companies know how to exploit them (versus the reality of having no alternative - until they become "heritage" acts)? This session has suggested many issues to be discussed & developed next year. |
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12:00 - 13:30 |
NEW TECHNOLOGY-JUST THE TICKET? |
Peter Tudor |
(Room 1, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden]
Chairman:
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With a panel drawn from all aspects of the touring industry, and some lively
contributions from the floor, the session covered the full range of issues
currently affecting the way our customers are currently accessing gigs.
Gigi Dryer's Aloud.com 'Emapās ticketing website' was the first interactive UK ticket shop in 1997, and relaunched in 2003 with an editorially rich site that promotes tickets through content, engaging with fans as well as providing crossover to Emap brands from Kerrang to Smash Hits. From her research Gigi has established that consumers will be using technology more and more ' and have higher expectations of the service they want to receive. Technology has made purchasing a ticket easier, and digital media and multi-channel choices need to embraced by all concerned. But if traditional paper tickets are not quite a thing of the past, Ronnie Forbes of Mobiqa was keen to expound the virtues of the use of mobile phones as the ticket of the future. At the point of purchase, the customer elects to have the mobi-ticket sent to their mobile, with a unique bar code which - on arrival at the gig - gives access to the venue. This is not just a future option ' events from Scotland to Australia have already incorporated the Mobiqa technology as another option for their customers.
Print@Home ticketing already in operation in a number of territories. But is this what the fans want? Guido Karp is not so sure. He's has been shifting large volumes of tickets through his Fans United business by making the ticket buying process more exciting with added extras to incentivise the customers. He also questions what happens when your mobile dies/changes/is stolen or when you want to buy the ticket as a present for someone else? Souvenir tickets generate the excitement of gig-going from the moment of purchase ' they may be less convenient but they are more exciting for the fans. As an example, Guido cited the recent Ramstein tour for which Fans United shifted some 177,000 tickets. On the other hand, as Ronnie pointed out, the new generation of mobile phones will allow the vendor to add in extras such as music video streaming, along with other options like vouchers and special offer promotions, creating that excitement. The key to all of this is the venue installing the access control equipment, having confidence that it will be secure and fraud proof, and extending the customer dialogue beyond just providing seat and row number. But we seem to need convincing: very few of the audience had started to use these new technologies, and there was some scepticism in the room about the security of the new options, in particular the ease with which a print@home ticket might be photocopied. The challenge of the new technologies is ensuring that fraud is eliminated, and given the ongoing issues of etouting across Europe, any advances that can sort this out would be welcome. Pete Wilson of UK promoter 3A Entertainment has certainly had some problems with the new etoutsā operating on the web. Within 24 hours of his Kylie tour going on sale there were hundreds of tickets on eBay, and he's been working with the venues to cancel/refund over 12,000 tickets. As he pointed out, it's not just the occasional ticket holder doing this 'there are multiple purchasers at work, and the touts are using eBay' either to shift tickets themselves or to get access to tickets being sold. An outsider might look at this and query why we are not simply happy to be selling tickets. But Geoff Huckstep from Nottingham Arena explained the aftermath of the issues arising from etouting. Non-existent tickets, mis-sold tickets, marked-up tickets are all problems for audiences, and venue staff get the brunt of it on the night. Geoff warned that one bad experience can deter people from coming to future shows: the more people are ripped off, the less they can afford in future. The National Arenas Association is calling for more education for customers, positive information. As Bernard emphasized, education is also the key for the new technologies ' as customers need to know that simply copying bar codes is no guarantee of accessing the gig. Flemming Schmidt of CCE/DKB Motor agreed that 'having been reluctant to embrace the print@home opportunity' he was now convinced that this was the way forward. Touting in the UK is legal for theatre/music tickets, but not for football tickets. The laws vary across Europe. Flemming explained that it is illegal to sell a ticket for more than face value in Denmark, but that it happens nonetheless. He is lobbying for the law to be tightened, and is keen on using technology to make the ticket more personalized to the purchaser so that they cannot be sold on. But the other problem is that some of these rogue agents are not registered in the country in which they selling. So EU legislation may be the key. eBay is less of an issue in Europe at the moment, but is growing. One of the promoters present disclosed that he had sold some tickets for his own gigs on eBay complete with a modest mark up though no one else in the room was prepared to admit to this!
A new development in auction sites is already in use in the US. Paul La
Fontaine of Ticketmaster explained that Ticketmaster's variable pricing
modelā has already proved successful, allowing the customer to set the price
but with the revenue going to the talent/promoter rather than the tout. So are we charging too little for tickets? Does etouting demonstrate what ticket prices should be? Or are tickets so expensive that people need to subsidize their trip to see the show by buying more? And do we therefore risk reducing our audience by cracking down on them?
And if we refunded tickets would this eliminate the problem? Are we
encouraging the customer to put tickets up for auction? Can this work for
the live entertainment industry, where the key Box Office objective is
usually to sell out as quickly as possible. If a show isn't sold out, then
promoters are naturally reluctant to refund in the hope of reselling. Jonathan Browne is working with the UK's Concert Promoters Association and the NAA to look at some of these issues following the recent OFT report. He explained that STAR (the UK's Society of Ticket Agents and Retailers) was established to provide consumer information on the whole ticket buying process and most legitimate agents are members. The Office of Fair Trading report had been positive about the primary market, but raised concerns over ticket touts. However, the OFT aims to use existing legislation to combat the problem. Paul Sergeant, of the Millennium Stadium believes that the current law is simply not tight enough, as he has learned from the multiple eBay sellers for the Tsunami benefit concert in Cardiff this year. The ILMC session raised lots of questions, and we can hopefully follow up with some of the answers in 2006. Technology may be the key to the current problems - but we need to get it installed, get the customers educated for wise buying, and get some legislation in place to enforce it all. Peter Tudor (National Arenas Association) |
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12:00 - 13:30 |
MUSIC TANK |
Keith Harris |
(Room 3, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden] Chairman:
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12:00 - 13:30 |
THE ENGINE ROOM: |
Dougie Souness |
(Room 4, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden]
Chairman:
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This panel examined that vital area - the payout at the end of the show, it
sought to detail what makes up 'the cake' and exactly how it is divided. It also
considered how well the rest of the industry services the tour party with the
help of panellists:
Chairman's Comment:
Our panel discussed what makes up the income 'cake' in the first place with the audience paying for the concert ticket, food, drink, car parking, merchandising etc. We then had a look at how that cake is divided and looked closely at the role of everyone involved including venues; promoters; agents; managers; merchandisers; concessionaires; accountants; tour managers; collection societies etc. We examined show costs in detail, discussed new income streams, and practical issues facing everyone involved during both the actual planning of and execution of a tour. We clarified the venue merchandise concession fees charges charged on top of venue hire, an area that artist managers and merchandisers are particularly concerned with. In summary, we decided that advanced planning and communication with everyone involved was an absolute must these days, in order that everyone can benefit from savings and new income opportunities. The VAT situation on Concession fees which amount to 25% of merchandising take in most venues was a topic raised, the MMF are investigating the implications of this for their members and their artists and intend to issue a report, which will hopefully feature in Summer 2005 issue of IQ. |
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14:30 - 16:00 |
CORPORATISATION: |
Wayne Forte |
(Room 1, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden]
Chairman:
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Chairman's Comment:
I feel the panel was very successful, from the standpoint of 'getting the information and various points a view out' to the attending delegates, giving them food for further thought and, perhaps, even a bit of entertainment! However, since I was on the podium presenting, I would really be interested to hear opinions from the audience in order to get the various thoughts and opinions 'on the floor for discussion', I had hoped to actually have differing points of view and opinions among the various panelists which, I feel certain, was achieved. Obviously, the one that comes most to mind was the disagreement between Claudio Trotta and John Giddings (Don't ask - you had to be there! - Ed.). While there may have been some 'personal feelings' mixed in amongst the issues, it is the 'agree-disagree' scenario, which, in my opinion, sparks, and fuels further thought for everyone. Having the ability to call upon additional panelists for 'specific' issues or topics, further assisted in presenting varied opinions as well as adding 'expertise' in their specific areas of the consolidation movement. As far as the issue of 'consolidation in the music industry - where are we now?', I did not feel that is was my responsibility to present a definitive statement, solution or answer to all the questions, but rather to present as much information as possible to enable everyone to draw his or her own conclusions. While consolidation is certainly here, and here to stay (and for the most part has existed in many ways, shapes and forms for some time now, as I attempted to illustrate), my objective was to present information and varied points of view in order for each delegate attending to have both a learning and information gathering opportunity, as well as an 'enjoyable afternoon' at the ILMC. I can only hope this was the case.
John Giddings: The evidence seemed to be that the corporatisation of the industry
had created more revenue and financial security. It can't be argued that is has
killed creativity either-it has provided the money to launch new projects. Neil Warnock: Glad the feedback was good on the Corporatisation panel. I didn't myself feel it was far reaching enough, although Wayne did a spectacular job as usual. Like many of the panels, side issues come up which deflect from the main issue. I also felt too much of the discussion revolved around what happens in the US, rather than Europe and other parts of the world, which I felt the audience would have liked to hear more about. |
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14:30 - 16:00 |
ON THE RECORD [or is it..?] |
On The Record Panel |
(Room 3, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden] Chairman:
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14:30 - 16:00 |
THE VENUES' VENUE |
Venues Panel |
(Room 4, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden]
Chairman:
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Chairman's Comments:
We had an interesting session with Peter Tudor, who presented our annual NAA (National Arenas Association) statistics. Some of the highlights were the increase in ticket prices, and as we're now reporting on 17 venues as opposed to 15, the figures we presented did show the sensitivity. We also introduced the opening of the new European District of the International Association of Assembly Managers (IAAM) - this is connecting the world of facility management, presented by Dexter King, who contributed to a good debate about how we should be promoting education in Europe. The NAA venues are the Aberdeen Press & Journal Arena, Bournemouth International Centre, Brighton Centre, Cardiff International Arena, Earls Court, Hallam FM Arena Sheffield, King's Hall Belfast, NEC Arena, National Indoor Arena Birmingham, Nottingham Arena, Odyssey Belfast, The Point Dublin, Royal Albert Hall, the SECC Arena Glasgow and Wembley Arena. NAA Statistics:
UK artists played to over 2.2m people. Busted may have topped the chart, but Duran Duran (183,544 tickets sold over 22 shows) and Will Young (169,449 with 17 shows) complete the top three of the hardest working arena acts for the year.' This run of success looks set to continue into 2005, with major artists lined up to play the UK over the coming months. Kylie, Rod Stewart, Anastacia, Neil Diamond, and Destiny's Child are all out on the road in the next few weeks, with McFly set to take on Busted's mantle and plenty more big names yet to be announced for the end of the year. KEY FINDINGS
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16:15 - 17:45 |
FESTIVAL FORUM: |
JP Bordahl |
(Room 2, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden]
Chairman:
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This year's Festival Forum concentrated on the environmental aspects and
responsibilities of festivals and their organisers. The concrete goal for this
session was to form a small group of people to see through a project that could
work in the same way that the ILMC Safety Focus Group has progressed through the
past years, to create a handbook of environmental topics for festival and outdoor
events on an European level in accordance to EU regulations.
This session proved that even poorly attended panels will produce positive results which will be sustainable and important elements of future conferences: a small but involved session agreed to follow the proposal to produce an 'environmental handbook' for festivals which could prepare them and allow them to introduce their own ways of doing things before they find themselves faced with the compulsory legislation which will soon be on the statute books in many countries. The Summer issue of IQ will feature an explanation of the necessary content of such a handbook along with suggestions for its introduction written by Arnt Olaf Andersen. |
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16:15 - 17:45 |
'MEET THE NEW BOSS' |
Jake Smid |
(Room 3, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden]
Chairmen:
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This was one of the best-attended meetings in the smaller rooms, and may well
have to be promoted to one of the larger spaces next year. The session displayed
the intent that exists amongst the younger players in the industry and certainly
helped to energise ILMC 17.
Chairman Helen Madel contributes the following overview of the panel's themes and this will be the first of what we intend to be regular 'New Boss' articles written by young members of the live music business community in upcoming issues of IQ - the ILMC quarterly journal: Did we Meet the New Boss? Our gathering at the ILMC sought to answer the question: Where and how will we find the new boss? Whilst the business consolidates and becomes a recognised Industry to our governments, how will the new generation help mould the next 50 years?
With the industry leaders now being seen as our elder statesmen, we asked have
they prepared the way for the next generation. With the general view still held
that the cronyism of the "Old Boys Club" does exist amongst their established
network of promoters, it would seem the New Boys Club (NBC) is right behind! Made
up of like minded younger generation managers, agents and promoters, the NBC works
the new acts that are applicable to them - the acts they respect and understand. With the sudden increase in university courses in Live Music Management we asked whether these courses really were the place to discover our new boss. Whilst some of these courses have seen high level graduate appointments in societies such as PRS, PPL and MCPS, we are yet to see any rise through the ranks to the top of the game in live music. But with at least three graduates working at SJM and Helter Skelter in the UK alone, maybe this is just the tip of the educational iceberg. However the question that many asked over the session was are we going to produce more graduates than the business can accommodate? Yet a surprising upturn from years past at ILMC, we saw positive feedback that these courses were the way to give a good basic grounding in the business. Better to hire someone with passion, talent and drive and who knows how to understand a settlement sheet! Perhaps it is the younger generation, who've seen litigation become a way of life, who realise that becoming a more professional body with a better understanding of those constraints which we now have to work to, is the future for the industry. Yet it would seem that it is a new generation of Artists who are now more clued up and we as a group have to answer to the questions they pose to us on a daily basis and with the onset of blackberries and mobile phones we are expected to be contactable at any time. Clearly technology is taking us into a new era of concert going and with the onset of new disciplines such as Instant Live, we have to understand and embrace the technology of this generation. Will we see audiences becoming more technologically aware and demand downloadable instant recordings of the show or backstage content sent direct to their mobile phones? In conclusion we asked what the New Boss's legacy might be. Perhaps via closer links to government departments or closer ties to the record labels. Perhaps it is one of a standardisation of the industry with costing and settlement sheets issues by agents? Will our industry be manned by those individuals who have the broadest understanding of technology and grounding in law and finance. Which begs the final question - will the fun go out of the business we call Live? |
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16:15 - 17:45 |
THE OPEN FORUM: |
Feargal Sharkey |
(Room 4, Lower Ground Floor, Royal Garden]
Chairman:
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Feargal and four other members of the Live Music Forum were present to give
details of their work over the last year. Feargal identified the research that
had been undertaking by MORI into the potential positive effects of the Licensing
Act 2003 and suggested that there was a simplicity to the new licensing rules in
the UK.
A number of speakers from the floor questioned why government and government departments such as the DCMS were so poor at engaging with the live music industry, citing recent examples of such as the Licensing Act and the new Employment Agency regulations as examples of poor consultation with the music industry. Feargal pointed out how poor the live music industry was at engaging with politicians - and that the existing Music Business Forum was dominated by record labels and publishers. It was pointed out that the UK's Concert Promoters Association had just 37 members who each paid £500 so existed on a budget of less than £20,000 per annum, a pittance when action is needed on both UK and European legislation (of which large amounts can be expected). Peter Jenner and Feargal Sharkey both suggested that the live music industry react quickly and provide the LMF with ideas to put forward to Government in the short term if it wanted things considered. Feargal pointed out that an all-party parliamentary committee for music existed chaired by John Roberts MP and that recently MPS had enjoyed music events at the Houses of Parliament with more planned. Post Conference News: Since the Conference it has become obvious that the uptake on applications for the new licenses in the UK required in accordance with the Licensing Act 2003 by pub and venue owners is minimal - if the applications are not delivered to the local Authorities by the deadline of August 6 then the majority of pubs and venues in the UK could be unlicensed and trading illegally with the threat of being closed down. |
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